deviant inc's maths thread

# 01 Nov, 2013 09:50
deviant.inc	Ever since Daniele first puts down maths in an early episode I've been itching to write a defence of the subject. However, I don't want to make it defensive or combative, I'm a lover not a fighter so I want to seduce you with the ideas. I've been waiting until I've caught up to ensure I don't reiterate something that appears in an episode, and I'm glad I did as in later episodes there are some really interesting things I want to draw into the threads of what I want to say. I feel about Math the same that Daniele feels about History - that it's lack of popularity has more to do with the dry academic way it's often imparted, but when it's taught in the right way it becomes much more interesting and accessible. It's harder to do with Math though, as History has millions of cool, beautiful, violent, dramatic stories to grab the attention, but Math is often very abstract so a narrative has to be constructed to grab the imagination. To that end, I'm intending to mix in the history of a given subject, talking about the people who thought or developed ideas as well as the ideas themselves (Bill Bryson did this is ‘A Short History of Nearly Everything’ to great effect). I personally became extremely interested in Math around about the point that Rich said he was put off - when they started on ‘imaginary numbers’. I found the whole idea mind-blowing! Imaginary numbers! I should have seen my later love-affair with psychedelics in this enjoyment of having my mind blown. I love that feeling you get with psychedelics, like your mind is being tunred inside out, and I get the same feeling when I try to, not just remember, but really understand the mathematics. Anyhow, I'm gonna work on a short story of imaginary numbers to post in a week or so. Until then, Arthur's talk of spirals and nature reminded me of this Math inspired video - watch it, it's one of the most beautiful animations I've ever seen (I would embed it, but another user said that sets off the spam-filter, so just follow the link. Watch in HD, it's worth it!): http://youtu.be/kkGeOWYOFoA ———————————————– –“One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die…. ” quote

# 01 Nov, 2013 09:50

Ever since Daniele first puts down maths in an early episode I've been itching to write a defence of the subject. However, I don't want to make it defensive or combative, I'm a lover not a fighter so I want to seduce you with the ideas. I've been waiting until I've caught up to ensure I don't reiterate something that appears in an episode, and I'm glad I did as in later episodes there are some really interesting things I want to draw into the threads of what I want to say.

I feel about Math the same that Daniele feels about History - that it's lack of popularity has more to do with the dry academic way it's often imparted, but when it's taught in the right way it becomes much more interesting and accessible. It's harder to do with Math though, as History has millions of cool, beautiful, violent, dramatic stories to grab the attention, but Math is often very abstract so a narrative has to be constructed to grab the imagination. To that end, I'm intending to mix in the history of a given subject, talking about the people who thought or developed ideas as well as the ideas themselves (Bill Bryson did this is ‘A Short History of Nearly Everything’ to great effect).

I personally became extremely interested in Math around about the point that Rich said he was put off - when they started on ‘imaginary numbers’. I found the whole idea mind-blowing! Imaginary numbers! I should have seen my later love-affair with psychedelics in this enjoyment of having my mind blown. I love that feeling you get with psychedelics, like your mind is being tunred inside out, and I get the same feeling when I try to, not just remember, but really understand the mathematics.

Anyhow, I'm gonna work on a short story of imaginary numbers to post in a week or so. Until then, Arthur's talk of spirals and nature reminded me of this Math inspired video - watch it, it's one of the most beautiful animations I've ever seen (I would embed it, but another user said that sets off the spam-filter, so just follow the link. Watch in HD, it's worth it!):

http://youtu.be/kkGeOWYOFoA

———————————————–

–“One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die…. ”

# 03 Nov, 2013 23:10
BennyB	Hey buddy, I watched the vid…didn't do much for me personally I have to say. I did watch a really cool BBC documentary a while ago about some of the most famous 20th century mathematicians…I'm forgetting the exact details now but I think it plotted the lives of 4 guys, who all were trying to prove (mathematically) the nature of infinity. Anyway, they all went batshit and committed suicide. So, there's that. But, it was interesting how (at that level) Maths was fairly indistinguishable from philosophy. I think the thing that people struggle with (at least I do) is that maths is kind of an arbitrary language to describe something which is already there, but abstract (be it distance, or time, or quantity). So is written or spoken language I guess, for the most part, but people tend to understand it at a deeper level than maths which makes it more versatile and interesting. BTW - this forum must have the hardest ‘captchas’ in the world. I am a human primate hominid (non robot) & it takes me on average at least 4 goes to get one right! quote

# 03 Nov, 2013 23:10

BennyB

Hey buddy, I watched the vid…didn't do much for me personally I have to say.

I did watch a really cool BBC documentary a while ago about some of the most famous 20th century mathematicians…I'm forgetting the exact details now but I think it plotted the lives of 4 guys, who all were trying to prove (mathematically) the nature of infinity. Anyway, they all went batshit and committed suicide. So, there's that. But, it was interesting how (at that level) Maths was fairly indistinguishable from philosophy.

I think the thing that people struggle with (at least I do) is that maths is kind of an arbitrary language to describe something which is already there, but abstract (be it distance, or time, or quantity). So is written or spoken language I guess, for the most part, but people tend to understand it at a deeper level than maths which makes it more versatile and interesting.

BTW - this forum must have the hardest ‘captchas’ in the world. I am a human primate hominid (non robot) & it takes me on average at least 4 goes to get one right!

# 04 Nov, 2013 09:31
deviant.inc	Different folks, different strokes I guess…. Yeah, beyond a certain level Math does feel a bit like Philosophy, which is one of the things I love about it, but it has a definite internal logic. It's also incredibly interesting when you set up a mathematical system with a few simple rules, but end up with amazing emergent properties never even guessed at when you started. I'll have to look out for that BBC doc though, sounds worth a watch. Personally, my favourite description of infinity is the Riemann sphere's pole. Maybe I'll write about the Riemann sphere after I've talked about complex numbers… It is definitely another language. One that I find really helpful in understanding the world around me. But the language isn't exactly arbitrary (though some things can be), but it is a) specialist and b) specific - this makes it difficult to understand as often terms will have very specific meanings, but that the average person will not understand them. I guess that's part of what I was getting at when I mentioned how I feel it's taught badly, what concentrating on names and dates does to History, clinging to specialist terms without explanation does to Math. I hope I'll do a bit better at avoiding that by simply explaining things in everyday language. Yeah, the captchas are a bitch. I think it's how often they drop off the bottom of the image, I keep asking myself ‘is that an I, J, or L?’… ———————————————– –“One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die…. ” quote

# 04 Nov, 2013 09:31

deviant.inc

Different folks, different strokes I guess….

Yeah, beyond a certain level Math does feel a bit like Philosophy, which is one of the things I love about it, but it has a definite internal logic. It's also incredibly interesting when you set up a mathematical system with a few simple rules, but end up with amazing emergent properties never even guessed at when you started. I'll have to look out for that BBC doc though, sounds worth a watch. Personally, my favourite description of infinity is the Riemann sphere's pole. Maybe I'll write about the Riemann sphere after I've talked about complex numbers…

It is definitely another language. One that I find really helpful in understanding the world around me. But the language isn't exactly arbitrary (though some things can be), but it is a) specialist and b) specific - this makes it difficult to understand as often terms will have very specific meanings, but that the average person will not understand them. I guess that's part of what I was getting at when I mentioned how I feel it's taught badly, what concentrating on names and dates does to History, clinging to specialist terms without explanation does to Math. I hope I'll do a bit better at avoiding that by simply explaining things in everyday language.

Yeah, the captchas are a bitch. I think it's how often they drop off the bottom of the image, I keep asking myself ‘is that an I, J, or L?’…